Here's a significantly reworded version of the MDX content, preserving meaning and structure:
Hey there. This is a discussion aimed at finding a solution for the large amount of The Old Republic content related to the Outlander/Alliance Commander storyline (starting with TOR 4.0 Knights of the Fallen Empire). This content is difficult to properly integrate because of the influence of player choices. This makes creating new articles harder, as we're forced to describe everything in the Behind the scenes sections, which defeats the purpose of those sections.
The narrative has progressed to a point where definitively stating which faction the Commander supports is impossible, as it would ignore a significant portion of the storyline. Simply writing about the common elements (as we did with older SWTOR content) is no longer sufficient, because the shared aspects are limited and outcomes, especially in battles, vary greatly.
For instance, in Mission to Onderon, a Republic-aligned Commander assists Senator Deja Nebet against the Empire and King Regalun Petryph, ultimately preventing the Empire from destroying the Republic fleet. Conversely, an Empire-aligned Commander collaborates with King Petryph and Darth Savik, leading to the destruction of the Republic fleet. This, and similar elements in the 6.0 Onslaught story (as well as in previous ones), result in the Commander's chosen faction winning a decisive victory.
My suggestion is to continue the Republic-light side and Empire-dark side pattern. However, since we can't declare one affiliation as canon, I propose that we (unconventionally) acknowledge both. Specifically, I suggest splitting the Commander article into two separate articles: The Commander (Republic) and The Commander (Empire).
Here's how it would function:
-The Commander (Republic) article would present a pro-Republic viewpoint, treating all light side choices and support for the Republic as canon, with other choices relegated to the Bts section as gameplay alternatives. -The Commander (Empire) article would present a pro-Empire viewpoint, treating all dark side choices and support for the Empire as canon, with other choices relegated to the Bts section as gameplay alternatives. -Content where light/dark choices and support for the Empire/Republic significantly affect the story and outcomes will be divided into the previous game mechanics sections, which could be applied in the same article together. -Both main articles would have prominent templates at the top, explaining the division and linking to a consensus track topic (if this proposal is approved).
- How would this approach affect other articles? For example, the Battle of Corellia (Third Galactic War)? Would those also need to be split? Fan26 ( Talk ) 01:08, October 29, 2019 (UTC) My proposal is specifically designed to avoid that. We could incorporate the article's main content within both game mechanic templates. Winterz (talk) 01:13, October 29, 2019 (UTC) I don't believe that's a good approach. Currently, despite its flaws, using the BtS to cover both choices is the best available option. While covering the diverging storylines is challenging, it's not yet so difficult as to require this or similar measures, in my opinion. This system could be quite confusing. Fan26 (Talk) 01:22, October 29, 2019 (UTC) I agree with Fan; however, we do need to improve the current system. The BtS sections should also mention the minor differences between each class that experiences The Alliance Commander storyline. --Rakhsh (talk) 01:44, October 29, 2019 (UTC) I understand the potential for confusion, but there is some precedent. The Battle of Corellia already uses both dark side and light side gamemechanic templates within the article's body. This approach could be applied to most battles/major events in SWTOR. We should aim to write from both perspectives within the article's main content, not just in the Behind the scenes section. The Behind the scenes section should be reserved for minor and alternative gameplay details. If there's a viable method for writing articles (and there is precedent), we should pursue it. Winterz (talk) 15:25, October 29, 2019 (UTC) I'm fairly certain the reason the Vanilla content uses both dark side and light side templates is because all 8 class stories occurred. In this instance, we don't know which event occurred, and writing both LS and DS stories within the article would only cause confusion. I'm with Fan on this. Perhaps we could decide which story (LS or DS) to use for the article, with the other story added to the BTS.--DarthRuiz30 (talk) 20:00, November 1, 2019 (UTC)
- Regarding the Outlander/Commander, I propose using a series of tab boxes, similar to those used on the Assassin's Creed wiki, to represent all light/dark/neutral choices in the biography.-- Unic of the borg ( talk ) 01:32, October 29, 2019 (UTC) And similar to Canon/Legends. If the situation becomes dire, that could be a good solution. Fan26 (Talk) 01:34, October 29, 2019 (UTC) I like Unic's idea. Fan, I think you're underestimating the severity of the problem. Consider Darth Shaar, Darth Savik, and Dantooine Incursion. We're no longer writing articles; we're only creating behind-the-scenes sections. Winterz (talk) 01:48, October 29, 2019 (UTC) I agree with Winterz on this. --Rakhsh (talk) 01:50, October 29, 2019 (UTC) There's still not much precedent for this. I like the idea, but I honestly don't think the situation is that critical yet. Fan26 (Talk) 12:58, October 29, 2019 (UTC) Many articles are on hold pending a consensus on this issue. Currently, you can only add background information and present everything as gameplay alternatives. Winterz (talk) 15:20, October 29, 2019 (UTC) I'm not convinced the situation is bad enough to warrant tab separation or other emergency measures to cover all the information. As annoying as it is, I'm more comfortable with the BtS covering everything for the time being. Fan26 (Talk) 14:55, October 30, 2019 (UTC)
- I haven't played TOR recently, so please correct me if I'm wrong, but have all the characters been merged into a single player character: the Commander? If so, and everyone is playing the same character within the continuity, the most logical solution is to revert to our standard practice of assuming light side choices, meaning the Commander sides with the Republic, and all Empire-aligned information goes into the BTS. Ayrehead02 ( talk ) 12:56, October 30, 2019 (UTC) The faction decision was actually morally neutral. One would think siding with the Republic would be a Light Side Choice, and Empire a Dark Side one, but for whatever reason, neither one is a Light or Dark choice. Fan26 (Talk) 14:55, October 30, 2019 (UTC) While the decision might not be explicitly labeled as such, isn't the Sith Empire inherently a dark side faction, and the Republic and Jedi inherently light side factions? Ayrehead02 (talk) 15:39, October 30, 2019 (UTC) You're right, but the problem is that there's an entire story arc associated with the dark side. It's not just a minor dark side decision; it's a distinct narrative with different outcomes. If we assume Empire characters join the Republic, it creates even more complications and significant ramifications. There should be two separate sides, two separate stories. Winterz (talk) 19:25, October 30, 2019 (UTC) Although I'm not opposed to this approach if a better solution doesn't emerge from this discussion. It would likely result in an imbalance, with the Republic winning most battles, but it's still better than the current situation (where we're at a standstill). Winterz (talk) 19:29, October 30, 2019 (UTC) While I understand that relegating the entire Empire storyline to the BTS is not ideal, I'm not sure I see any other viable solution. If there's only one Commander, they can't have joined both the Empire and the Republic. Therefore, we can't present both possibilities within the main article content, as it would be contradictory, and article bodies should only present one consistent version of events. Ayrehead02 (talk) 20:21, October 30, 2019 (UTC) ^Exactly. Fan26 (Talk) 18:08, October 31, 2019 (UTC) I'll be initiating a CT on this soon. Winterz (talk) 15:19, November 1, 2019 (UTC)